|
|
|
|
Tiribulus
Level 1
Join date: Aug 2006
Location: Michigan, USA
Posts: 8079
|
|
I thought this might be an interesting discussion.
For instance I lost 10 soft pounds give or take over the summer by accident changing absolutely nothing other than intentionally getting a sane, but significant amount of sun. Same food, same training same activity level.
It is now several weeks since the sun went south, my tan is almost gone and the fat is coming back, again changing absolutely nothing else. (I wish I would've got some picks)
I don't care because I know where it will stop.
I remember reading something years ago that discussed the anabolic/androgenic effects of natural sunlight and I thought this summer's experience was pretty interesting. |
|
| Report Post |
|
|
 |
|
|
Tiznut
Level 0
Join date: Dec 2008
Location: California, USA
Posts: 127
|
|
Tiribulus wrote:
I thought this might be an interesting discussion.
For instance I lost 10 soft pounds give or take over the summer by accident changing absolutely nothing other than intentionally getting a sane, but significant amount of sun. Same food, same training same activity level.
It is now several weeks since the sun went south, my tan is almost gone and the fat is coming back, again changing absolutely nothing else. (I wish I would've got some picks)
I don't care because I know where it will stop.
I remember reading something years ago that discussed the anabolic/androgenic effects of natural sunlight and I thought this summer's experience was pretty interesting.
So getting this extra sun what did you do. Simply walk outside and sit or what? With the sun down and you back inside what are you doing with your down time? |
|
| Report Post |
|
|
 |
|
|
reneeweimer
Level 2
Join date: Oct 2005
Location: Washington, USA
Posts: 2685
|
|
Are you bringing this up so that we can talk about seratonin levels & it's effects on body fat percentage? We could do that.
Or are you bringing it up for the "latent" exercise levels, as Tiznut mentions? |
|
| Report Post |
|
|
 |
|
|
KSman
Level 0
Join date: Aug 2006
Location:
Posts: 2513
|
|
Part of this is Vit-D, take 2000-3000iu per day. Those with darker skin make less Vit-D from sunlight exposure. |
|
| Report Post |
|
|
 |
|
|
Dave284
Level 3
Join date: May 2007
Location: England
Posts: 421
|
|
Personally Im definitely more lean in the summer, although its hard to tell what this is due too.
I defnintely do more exercise in the summer in terms of throwing a ball around, walking more places etc.
I do certainly feel better somehow when the suns out more.
|
|
| Report Post |
|
|
 |
|
|
B rocK
Level 4
Join date: Jan 2006
Location: Massachusetts, USA
Posts: 3912
|
|
Well as we all know; the winter is 'prone' to bring on feelings of sluggishness and depression...but that's in 'normal' people. People like us that are training and are active have higher endorphin levels and shouldn't be AS susceptible to this.
In the summer, I'm more apt to hang outside as well. Walking the dog, hitting the bag, going for longer walks, going to the beach etc etc...
In the winter, the most activity I get outside is from letting my dog run about; and shoveling (which is a killer workout depending on snowfall). But I do feel a bit more lethargic when it's a non-training day. I gotta use my exercise bike a bit more...
|
|
| Report Post |
|
|
 |
|
|
Tiribulus
Level 1
Join date: Aug 2006
Location: Michigan, USA
Posts: 8079
|
|
Tiznut wrote:
Tiribulus wrote:
I thought this might be an interesting discussion.
For instance I lost 10 soft pounds give or take over the summer by accident changing absolutely nothing other than intentionally getting a sane, but significant amount of sun. Same food, same training same activity level.
It is now several weeks since the sun went south, my tan is almost gone and the fat is coming back, again changing absolutely nothing else. (I wish I would've got some picks)
I don't care because I know where it will stop.
I remember reading something years ago that discussed the anabolic/androgenic effects of natural sunlight and I thought this summer's experience was pretty interesting.
So getting this extra sun what did you do. Simply walk outside and sit or what? With the sun down and you back inside what are you doing with your down time?
I actually laid out there starting with 5 minutes a side and working up to 20 rotating myself around like a roast. I never got really burned, but I did get pretty tan and did get leaner while having some great workouts.
I know about vitamin D and also I remember reading that test is elevated by substantial sun exposure, but I don't remember where. |
|
| Report Post |
|
|
 |
|
|
matsm21
Level 4
Join date: Mar 2005
Location: New York, USA
Posts: 814
|
|
you're getting ready for hibernation yogi!! |
|
| Report Post |
|
|
 |
|
|
Tiribulus
Level 1
Join date: Aug 2006
Location: Michigan, USA
Posts: 8079
|
|
This started because I wanted the health benefits of sunlight regardless of what the idiotic medical establishment tries to tell us.
I doubt if I weighed myself 3 times all summer. I noticed by July that I was getting leaner. I thought I was imagining it at first. I weighed myself at the end of August and I was in the mid 230's even though I was getting stronger and my training was going great.
If anything I ate a bit more and got less overall exercise than during the winter when I was consistently walking like 15 miles a week up and down stairs through snow putting fliers on houses. I did that less during the summer because I had more business and less time to do fliers which meant I sat in front of computers more.
I'm convinced the sun was a major contributor if not THE factor in my losing that soft weight even though I did absolutely nothing to try and make that happen.
I didn't get real lean, but it was visibly noticeable and now I'm softening up a little with the only difference being no sun. |
|
| Report Post |
|
|
 |
|
|
Dave284
Level 3
Join date: May 2007
Location: England
Posts: 421
|
|
I have absolutely no evidence to back this up but tanned skin does look noticeably 'tighter' alomst than untanned skin. |
|
| Report Post |
|
|
 |
|
|
Short Hoss
Level 0
Join date: Jun 2008
Location:
Posts: 764
|
|
Tiri, a question-
Did you sleep better during the summer? What I'm getting at is the body uses the sun to shut off melatonin production and keep a regular circadian rhythm.
Sleep is anabolic. Although for the time I can't pinpoint the reasons for fat loss, I agree that sun exposure helps. Why? I sit out and tan during the summer, and I've noted that same benefits as you, Tiri. (Tanning beds are overrated and harmful in my opinion).
The next thing I'm researching is heat and UV rays and fat storage. I'll see if I can find any correlation. |
|
| Report Post |
|
|
 |
|
|
Tiribulus
Level 1
Join date: Aug 2006
Location: Michigan, USA
Posts: 8079
|
|
Short Hoss wrote:
Tiri, a question-
Did you sleep better during the summer?
>>>
I didn't sleep any longer, I don't sleep that much anyway, but I did feel more rested when I woke up. |
|
| Report Post |
|
|
 |
|
|
Short Hoss
Level 0
Join date: Jun 2008
Location:
Posts: 764
|
|
BAM! Sunlight messes with leptin.
Regulation of adipose tissue leptin secretion by alpha-melanocyte-stimulating hormone and agouti-related protein: further evidence of an interaction between leptin and the melanocortin signalling system
http://jme.endocrinology-journ... |
|
| Report Post |
|
|
 |
|
|
Short Hoss
Level 0
Join date: Jun 2008
Location:
Posts: 764
|
|
Tiribulus wrote:
Short Hoss wrote:
Tiri, a question-
Did you sleep better during the summer?
>>>
I didn't sleep any longer, I don't sleep that much anyway, but I did feel more rested when I woke up.
Interesting. Also, it's pretty funny that I'm researching studies when I'm the common sense guy. I better slow down; I got a reputation to keep! |
|
| Report Post |
|
|
 |
|
|
Tiribulus
Level 1
Join date: Aug 2006
Location: Michigan, USA
Posts: 8079
|
|
Short Hoss wrote:
Tiribulus wrote:
Short Hoss wrote:
Tiri, a question-
Did you sleep better during the summer?
>>>
I didn't sleep any longer, I don't sleep that much anyway, but I did feel more rested when I woke up.
Interesting. Also, it's pretty funny that I'm researching studies when I'm the common sense guy. I better slow down; I got a reputation to keep!
Nuthin wrong with keeping up with the science until the lab begins to "disprove" the gym. |
|
| Report Post |
|
|
 |
|
|
anonym
Level 3
Join date: Jan 2008
Location: Massachusetts, USA
Posts: 1826
|
|
In Arnold: The Education of a Bodybuilder, the Oak mentions laying outside in the sun in order to "burn off that extra layer of fat just beneath the skin" (or something to that effect; I don't have the book on me so I can't get an exact quote).
I had a little chuckle when I read that, but maybe he (and Tirib) are on to something. |
|
| Report Post |
|
|
 |
|
|
Short Hoss
Level 0
Join date: Jun 2008
Location:
Posts: 764
|
|
anonym wrote:
In Arnold: The Education of a Bodybuilder, the Oak mentions laying outside in the sun in order to "burn off that extra layer of fat just beneath the skin" (or something to that effect; I don't have the book on me so I can't get an exact quote).
I had a little chuckle when I read that, but maybe he (and Tirib) are on to something.
Science is too slow. I feel great when I get copious amounts of sun, even with D supplementation. I don't need science to tell me that sunlight is beneficial.
People need to get the hell outside. It's tanning beds that are killing people, not the sun. That's a whole 'nother discussion, though. |
|
| Report Post |
|
|
 |
|
|
Bill Roberts
Level 5
Join date: Mar 2003
Location:
Posts: 6875
|
|
I never had guys in the gym ask me if I was getting ready for a contest (it's a weird question as I don't remotely have the genetics) until getting a good tan, but after the tan have been asked that at least 8 or 10 times in the last few months.
It has been easier staying lean while well-tanned also.
The tan is from natural sun and Melanotan II.
It is known that Vitamin D aids fat loss. Whether there are other fat-loss benefits to the sun, I don't know. |
|
| Report Post |
|
|
 |
|
|
Short Hoss
Level 0
Join date: Jun 2008
Location:
Posts: 764
|
|
Okay, after much researching, this is what I've come to.
Melanin is produced by 2 two ways. Melanogenesis is one, and that is when melanocytes produce melanin. The other is the intriguing one. Melanin production also comes from Adrenocorticotropic hormone.
My theory is this: When tanning, ACTH is produced in the pituitary gland. The same process that produces ACTH also produces several other hormones, one of which is of monument importance to fat loss.
Lipotropin is produced along with ACTH and others (like β-endorphin which makes you feel good as you tan, at least I do).
Lipotropin stimulates melanocytes to produce melanin, but it also performs LIPOLYSIS and STEROIDOGENESIS!
That's right, lipolysis. Tan and burn that fat away.
|
|
| Report Post |
|
|
 |
|
|
NewDamage
Level 1
Join date: Oct 2003
Location: Alabama, USA
Posts: 1807
|
|
Short Hoss wrote:
Okay, after much researching, this is what I've come to.
Melanin is produced by 2 two ways. Melanogenesis is one, and that is when melanocytes produce melanin. The other is the intriguing one. Melanin production also comes from Adrenocorticotropic hormone.
My theory is this: When tanning, ACTH is produced in the pituitary gland. The same process that produces ACTH also produces several other hormones, one of which is of monument importance to fat loss.
Lipotropin is produced along with ACTH and others (like β-endorphin which makes you feel good as you tan, at least I do).
Lipotropin stimulates melanocytes to produce melanin, but it also performs LIPOLYSIS and STEROIDOGENESIS!
That's right, lipolysis. Tan and burn that fat away.
Nice info. To add, ACTH/B-Endorphin/B-Lipotropin/MSH (even though MSH isn't generallly present in adult humans) are all peptide hormones produced from a larger preprohormone called proopiomelanocortin (POMC.) Depending on how POMC is cleaved, different hormones are produced.
Basically, POMC is cleaved into two fragments:
1)one fragment contains the sequences for ACTH
2)another fragment contains the sequence for B-Lipotropin and B-endorphin
The anterior lobe of the pituitary contains some cells which make POMC, and here the POMC is cleaved to produce ACTH.
The other fragment, which contains the sequences for B-lipotropin and B-endorphin, could then conceivable be cleaved to produced these two peptide hormones, or even if its not cleaved, the fragment itself my exhibit lipolytic activity (albeit weaker than the final product.)
So Short Hoss, what information have you found regarding suntanning leading to an increase in ACTH production?
ACTH does have weak melanin-stimulating capabilities because it contains the amino acid sequence for MSH, but suntanning itself, to my knowledge, isnt regulated by MSH, so I don't know how much of an effect the ACTH has.
|
|
| Report Post |
|
|
 |
|
|
Short Hoss
Level 0
Join date: Jun 2008
Location:
Posts: 764
|
|
NewDamage wrote:
So Short Hoss, what information have you found regarding suntanning leading to an increase in ACTH production?
ACTH does have weak melanin-stimulating capabilities because it contains the amino acid sequence for MSH, but suntanning itself, to my knowledge, isnt regulated by MSH, so I don't know how much of an effect the ACTH has.
Sun Tanning is regulated by β-MSH (but also caused by pre-existing melaning oxidising). β-MSH is what stimulates the melanocytes and cause melanogenesis. Of course, as you have stated, all of the melanocortins are a product of POMC.
Sun tanning causes melanotropes in the pituitary gland to produce POMC to generate β-MSH. The POMC then is cleaved into ACTH, β-lipotropin, γ-lipotropin, ) β-MSH and β-endorphin.
By the way, correct me if I'm wrong. No sarcasm here, I'm still in basics in college, and I only read this kind of stuff for fun. |
|
| Report Post |
|
|
 |
|
|
Short Hoss
Level 0
Join date: Jun 2008
Location:
Posts: 764
|
|
NewDamage wrote:
Short Hoss wrote:
Okay, after much researching, this is what I've come to.
Melanin is produced by 2 two ways. Melanogenesis is one, and that is when melanocytes produce melanin. The other is the intriguing one. Melanin production also comes from Adrenocorticotropic hormone.
My theory is this: When tanning, ACTH is produced in the pituitary gland. The same process that produces ACTH also produces several other hormones, one of which is of monument importance to fat loss.
Lipotropin is produced along with ACTH and others (like β-endorphin which makes you feel good as you tan, at least I do).
Lipotropin stimulates melanocytes to produce melanin, but it also performs LIPOLYSIS and STEROIDOGENESIS!
That's right, lipolysis. Tan and burn that fat away.
Nice info. To add, ACTH/B-Endorphin/B-Lipotropin/MSH (even though MSH isn't generallly present in adult humans) are all peptide hormones produced from a larger preprohormone called proopiomelanocortin (POMC.) Depending on how POMC is cleaved, different hormones are produced.
Basically, POMC is cleaved into two fragments:
1)one fragment contains the sequences for ACTH
2)another fragment contains the sequence for B-Lipotropin and B-endorphin
The anterior lobe of the pituitary contains some cells which make POMC, and here the POMC is cleaved to produce ACTH.
The other fragment, which contains the sequences for B-lipotropin and B-endorphin, could then conceivable be cleaved to produced these two peptide hormones, or even if its not cleaved, the fragment itself my exhibit lipolytic activity (albeit weaker than the final product.)
So Short Hoss, what information have you found regarding suntanning leading to an increase in ACTH production?
ACTH does have weak melanin-stimulating capabilities because it contains the amino acid sequence for MSH, but suntanning itself, to my knowledge, isnt regulated by MSH, so I don't know how much of an effect the ACTH has.
Ah crap, sorry I've been doped up all day due to an injury. I hope my posts end up making sense. Basically the post you quoted (that I wrote) had some misinformation. Sorry, bud! |
|
| Report Post |
|
|
 |
|
|
Bauer97
Level 4
Join date: Aug 2005
Location: Pennsylvania, USA
Posts: 2638
|
|
I need to get outside more... and not just because my German/Swedish/Austrian heritage leaves me near-transparent by the end of Winter.
I get zero, and I mean literally zero, minutes of sun exposure during the workweek. I'll need to put some effort into remedying that situation, given what I've been reading lately. |
|
| Report Post |
|
|
 |
|
|
NewDamage
Level 1
Join date: Oct 2003
Location: Alabama, USA
Posts: 1807
|
|
Short Hoss wrote:
Sun Tanning is regulated by β-MSH (but also caused by pre-existing melaning oxidising). β-MSH is what stimulates the melanocytes and cause melanogenesis. Of course, as you have stated, all of the melanocortins are a product of POMC.
Sun tanning causes melanotropes in the pituitary gland to produce POMC to generate β-MSH. The POMC then is cleaved into ACTH, β-lipotropin, γ-lipotropin, ) β-MSH and β-endorphin.
By the way, correct me if I'm wrong. No sarcasm here, I'm still in basics in college, and I only read this kind of stuff for fun.
I'm not entirely sure either. From what I understand suntanning is not mediated by MSH but rather, like was mentioned, oxidized melanin, and UV DNA damage.
Because POMC is cleaved into ACTH, and then a-MSH in the intermediate pituitary (which adult humans don't have), I would expect the weak MSH activity of ACTH itself to possibly exert some effects, but didn't think it was a primary cause of suntanning.
Regardless, I do definitely think you're onto something with suntanning leading to an increase in B-Lipotropin which could very well explain the lipolytic effects, although to my knowledge there aren't a whole lot of known physiological functions of B-lip.
Nice job nerding everything up, by the way ;-) I dig it.
|
|
| Report Post |
|
|
 |
|
|
Short Hoss
Level 0
Join date: Jun 2008
Location:
Posts: 764
|
|
NewDamage wrote:
I'm not entirely sure either. From what I understand suntanning is not mediated by MSH but rather, like was mentioned, oxidized melanin, and UV DNA damage.
Because POMC is cleaved into ACTH, and then a-MSH in the intermediate pituitary (which adult humans don't have), I would expect the weak MSH activity of ACTH itself to possibly exert some effects, but didn't think it was a primary cause of suntanning.
Regardless, I do definitely think you're onto something with suntanning leading to an increase in B-Lipotropin which could very well explain the lipolytic effects, although to my knowledge there aren't a whole lot of known physiological functions of B-lip.
Nice job nerding everything up, by the way ;-) I dig it.
Humans do have an intermediate pituitary, but its only a thing layer between the anterior and posterior. You're right about the a-MSH; humans don't have that. However, humans do have b-MSH, and its used kick up melanogenesis.
Now when the pituitary makes POMC to make b-MSH we end up with the major products ACTH and b-lipotropin.
Or so I hope. ;-) I pulled my neck/trap, hence the time to nerd this thread up. Might as well use time wisely.
|
|
| Report Post |
|
|
 |
|
|
 |