| A Hypothetical for Everyone... |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Simon Forsyth
Level 1
Join date: Jan 2006
Location: Australia
Posts: 228
|
|
Now I know the Marine Corp has changed its physical fitness assesment (a marine friend of mine sent me their new training thing when he got it and he is a SSgt). Anyway with this move towards an assesment that is more appropriate to the actual needs of military personnel.
What would you guys like to see added or removed from PFS. Also for a lot of fun what do you think a perfect soldier would look like and what attributes do think they should possess, I honestly think that a perfect soldier would like Laurent Delvaux's statue of Hercules, strong rugged legs, big strong shoulders, rugged forearms, a heavy muscled back and posterior chain not too much in the way of pecs (I knew a paratrooper who had a massive chest and he said it was annoying along with his big arms when he was using the minimi), the perfect soldier wouldnt have massive arms though and their biceps and tricpes would only be .5-to-1 inche bigger than his forearms. Hey would have a decent set of traps on him as well. The prefect soldier would have the abilities cover a lot of distance with a heavy load, they woudl be able to sprint very well and sould not only lift heavy shit but also lift that heavy shit for a long period of time, kicks and punches would be strong and the could easily carry a wounded friend or two to safety. they could ovbiously support the loads on their backs. their hands would be strong as all hell (I remember reading a story in john Brookfields books about a guy who could rip a thick gain apart) and a CoC #4 wouldnt be a problem for this guys.
I also think that he would have very little fat on him due to his workload and job in general.
So yeah this is just for fun but I would like to see what everyone thinks..
Some thing I would like to see taken off of the PFA are below and I will expalin why as well:
* Push-ups (I dont see when you will be doing push-ups to save your life and its not a great way to test strength)
* Sit-ups (same as above)
* long jogs (when I was in the army we either marched in the field or we got a lift in an APC and the only running you do is short start, stop duck for cover type sprints).
What I would like to see added:
* Pull-ups (basic PFA doesnt use pull-ups its only when you get to certain units/battaliaons/regiments etc that pull-ups become important but in australia they get called heaves).
* Weighted Pull-ups (when in combat are you just in your PT gear there would be more carry over to the field).
* Buddy Carrys or SandBag carrys (this becausse at one point we have all had to carry either heavy loads or a wounded/injured mate).
* Deadlift test (this is simple because its a bsic function to pick something up from the ground)
* A better swiming test (In Australia we did a swiming test where we didnt have to swim very far and after that we woudl tread water for about 2 minutes, seeing as though we dont have a marine corp pur regular soldiers would act as a maratime infantry force in a conventional source and we did it when we went to east timor right at the start).
* An Ammo carry/Relay (you have to run with ammo up a hill then run back and pick up more ammo and keep repeating until all the ammo has been dropped of)...
I am sure I will think of more but I would love to hear other peoples ideas.
By the way the Laurent Delvaux's hercules statue I am refering to is the one form windor gardens, I saw it in an issue of MILO but I cant find a decent pic using google image search.. still any ideas would be great. |
|
| Report Post |
|
|
 |
|
|
superthrustjon
Level 1
Join date: Aug 2007
Location: Connecticut, USA
Posts: 241
|
|
When I was in the Marine Corps (about a year and a half ago) Our PFT consisted of pullups, situps and 3 mile run. So our daily PT didn't stray to far from this. We did a lot of other shit, but, well, stupid shit like crab walks and duck walks and log relays. I recently saw a video of how the marine corp is revamping their physical training and I really liked it, they stole a lot of crossfit style training. |
|
| Report Post |
|
|
|
|
|
Simon Forsyth
Level 1
Join date: Jan 2006
Location: Australia
Posts: 228
|
|
superthrustjon wrote:
When I was in the Marine Corps (about a year and a half ago) Our PFT consisted of pullups, situps and 3 mile run. So our daily PT didn't stray to far from this. We did a lot of other shit, but, well, stupid shit like crab walks and duck walks and log relays. I recently saw a video of how the marine corp is revamping their physical training and I really liked it, they stole a lot of crossfit style training.
Being a former digger I only know what my friend in the marines told me about their former PT and the new one.. I will see if I can post the PDF he sent me, although I know some of it was posted over at leatherneck.com (Please forgive me for not knowing what the website is actually called). It does seem very crossfit orientated but then there has to be a reason a lot of spec-ops/Sf are looking at cultfit for their fitness needs. |
|
| Report Post |
|
|
|
|
|
superthrustjon
Level 1
Join date: Aug 2007
Location: Connecticut, USA
Posts: 241
|
|
I think the corps is just realizing that all change isn't bad, out of all the services, the marine corps is VERY reluctant to change. Alot of crossfit things seem more useful than the same old PT they did during WWI. I know dozens of guys who never made it overseas or got medically discharged because of bad knees from stupid training. A 25 mile hump with a combat load may be "bad ass" but we simply don't do that in combat anymore, and it's murder on the knees. |
|
| Report Post |
|
|
|
|
|
minestrone
Level 0
Join date: Jun 2008
Location: Washington, USA
Posts: 13
|
|
i believe our pt test should include both a strength and an endurance component. the standing press and deadlift are two lifts any healthy in the military can be taught and graded on. there would be a minimum strength requirement for these lifts. situps are no good for the back and could be removed and possibly replaced with some type of pilates-based movement (if you've never done it, don't laugh--the core's functions are stability and torque control). i believe there could be two runs; a one-mile and a 5-mile. chin-ups are a given and i agree with the swim-test. --some units give the cwst(combat water survival test).
some of the extra stuff such as swimming and rucking are really on the unit. and yes, soldiers do need to be able to ruck and do need endurance.--better conditioned men can handle stressors more easily--bullets, cold, heat, etc...
perfect build...no such. i've seen all body types excel and some fat little guys do much better than fit looking studs. although i will admit that before i came in i thought i'd be the smallest guy around and that everyone would be in insane shape... |
|
| Report Post |
|
|
|
|
|
Simon Forsyth
Level 1
Join date: Jan 2006
Location: Australia
Posts: 228
|
|
minestrone wrote:
i believe our pt test should include both a strength and an endurance component. the standing press and deadlift are two lifts any healthy in the military can be taught and graded on. there would be a minimum strength requirement for these lifts. situps are no good for the back and could be removed and possibly replaced with some type of pilates-based movement (if you've never done it, don't laugh--the core's functions are stability and torque control). i believe there could be two runs; a one-mile and a 5-mile. chin-ups are a given and i agree with the swim-test. --some units give the cwst(combat water survival test).
some of the extra stuff such as swimming and rucking are really on the unit. and yes, soldiers do need to be able to ruck and do need endurance.--better conditioned men can handle stressors more easily--bullets, cold, heat, etc...
perfect build...no such. i've seen all body types excel and some fat little guys do much better than fit looking studs. although i will admit that before i came in i thought i'd be the smallest guy around and that everyone would be in insane shape...
Hey I agree that there is no perfect build but what I meant was more of hyothetical look such as a thick strong back from heavy deadlifts, oly lifts, pull-ups, obviously teh posterior chain would be more developed than the Pecs and Biceps, the legs wouldnt be massive tom platz type legs but again he would have hamstings that any bodybuilder would envy.. That type of thing. I just couldnt find the right words to describe what I am trying to get at.. Again its a hypothetical.
|
|
| Report Post |
|
|
|
|
|
reneeweimer
Level 2
Join date: Oct 2005
Location: Washington, USA
Posts: 2694
|
|
My Ideal Marine..... hee hee...
(I couldn't resist!) I think he would be great in combat. |
|
| Report Post |
|
|
|
|
|
World1187
Level 0
Join date: Aug 2007
Location:
Posts: 1034
|
|
reneeweimer wrote:
My Ideal Marine..... hee hee...
(I couldn't resist!) I think he would be great in combat.
Renee....
Where the hell did you find that picture of me?
OOH RAH!!!
World |
|
| Report Post |
|
|
|
|
|
Simon Forsyth
Level 1
Join date: Jan 2006
Location: Australia
Posts: 228
|
|
Just for the Record I love that sound marines make that whole OOH RAH thing.. Its say so much while saying so little.. |
|
| Report Post |
|
|
|
|
|
Loose Tool
Level 4
Join date: Nov 2004
Location:
Posts: 2224
|
|
Simon Forsyth wrote:
Now I know the Marine Corp has changed its physical fitness assesment (a marine friend of mine sent me their new training thing when he got it and he is a SSgt). Anyway with this move towards an assesment that is more appropriate to the actual needs of military personnel.
Supposedly the CFT (Combat Fitness Test) rolls out this month. It will supplement, not replace, the PFT. It will be given on a separate day. It will be pass/fail. It has three parts:
* The 880-yard sprint. Designed to simulate movement to contact, Marines will be timed running in a straight line.
* The ammo can lift. Marines will lift a 30-pound ammunition box from a starting position of chest level to above the head with both arms extended. Scores are based on the number of lifts performed in that set time period, but the scoring system is not yet approved.
* The maneuver under fire drill. A four-part obstacle course that will include sprinting, throwing a grenade, running with two ammo cans and moving a mock casualty.
|
|
| Report Post |
|
|
|
|
|
Simon Forsyth
Level 1
Join date: Jan 2006
Location: Australia
Posts: 228
|
|
Loose Tool wrote:
Simon Forsyth wrote:
Now I know the Marine Corp has changed its physical fitness assesment (a marine friend of mine sent me their new training thing when he got it and he is a SSgt). Anyway with this move towards an assesment that is more appropriate to the actual needs of military personnel.
Supposedly the CFT (Combat Fitness Test) rolls out this month. It will supplement, not replace, the PFT. It will be given on a separate day. It will be pass/fail. It has three parts:
* The 880-yard sprint. Designed to simulate movement to contact, Marines will be timed running in a straight line.
* The ammo can lift. Marines will lift a 30-pound ammunition box from a starting position of chest level to above the head with both arms extended. Scores are based on the number of lifts performed in that set time period, but the scoring system is not yet approved.
* The maneuver under fire drill. A four-part obstacle course that will include sprinting, throwing a grenade, running with two ammo cans and moving a mock casualty.
Yeah that shounds like the file I got I am still going to have to find a way of showing you guy swhat I received from my friend. |
|
| Report Post |
|
|
|
|
|
njworkoutguy
Level 2
Join date: Jan 2006
Location: New Jersey, USA
Posts: 201
|
|
I doubt that the CFT is ready to roll out yet. We had a bunch of high brass come out and test it here at TBS and it is nowhere near ready to employ in the fleet yet. Also its really not that great of a test unless it is conducted at the very small unit level, otherwise it allows too much rest time to really test anything. I personally didn't find the test to be very challenging and I did pretty well on it. |
|
| Report Post |
|
|
|
|
|
Loose Tool
Level 4
Join date: Nov 2004
Location:
Posts: 2224
|
|
njworkoutguy wrote:
I doubt that the CFT is ready to roll out yet. We had a bunch of high brass come out and test it here at TBS and it is nowhere near ready to employ in the fleet yet. Also its really not that great of a test unless it is conducted at the very small unit level, otherwise it allows too much rest time to really test anything. I personally didn't find the test to be very challenging and I did pretty well on it.
That's part of the reason I said "supposedly going to roll out". That and there appears to be opposition to it being required for E-7 and up. There is the notion that they will hurt themselves during rapid acceleration and turning.
|
|
| Report Post |
|
|
|
|
|
Simon Forsyth
Level 1
Join date: Jan 2006
Location: Australia
Posts: 228
|
|
Loose Tool wrote:
njworkoutguy wrote:
I doubt that the CFT is ready to roll out yet. We had a bunch of high brass come out and test it here at TBS and it is nowhere near ready to employ in the fleet yet. Also its really not that great of a test unless it is conducted at the very small unit level, otherwise it allows too much rest time to really test anything. I personally didn't find the test to be very challenging and I did pretty well on it.
That's part of the reason I said "supposedly going to roll out". That and there appears to be opposition to it being required for E-7 and up. There is the notion that they will hurt themselves during rapid acceleration and turning.
Remembering I am a Digger you guys will need to explain what E7 and up means.. I am assuming its some typoe of job cliasification or something???
Anywya I am off to bed I just woke up for a protein shake.
Cheers
Simon
|
|
| Report Post |
|
|
|
|
|
Loose Tool
Level 4
Join date: Nov 2004
Location:
Posts: 2224
|
|
Simon Forsyth wrote:
Loose Tool wrote:
njworkoutguy wrote:
I doubt that the CFT is ready to roll out yet. We had a bunch of high brass come out and test it here at TBS and it is nowhere near ready to employ in the fleet yet. Also its really not that great of a test unless it is conducted at the very small unit level, otherwise it allows too much rest time to really test anything. I personally didn't find the test to be very challenging and I did pretty well on it.
That's part of the reason I said "supposedly going to roll out". That and there appears to be opposition to it being required for E-7 and up. There is the notion that they will hurt themselves during rapid acceleration and turning.
Remembering I am a Digger you guys will need to explain what E7 and up means.. I am assuming its some typoe of job cliasification or something???
Anywya I am off to bed I just woke up for a protein shake.
Cheers
Simon
It's rank/pay grade:
E1 - private
E2 - private first class
E3 - lance corporal
E4 - corporal
E5 - sergeant
E6 - staff sergeant
E7 - gunnery sergeant
E8 - master sergeant/first sergeant
E9 - sergeant major/master gunnery sergeant
E9 - Sergeant Major of the Marine Corps (only one of these).
http://www.uspharmd.com/...cerankchart.htm
There maybe something to the concern regarding sprinting. Of course age generally correlates with rank. The only time I have been injured in the past four years has been while attempting to work sprinting into my training. Two pulled hamstrings and one pulled quad. And this is after several weeks of building up intensity for ten sets of sprints per session. |
|
| Report Post |
|
|
|
|
|
njworkoutguy
Level 2
Join date: Jan 2006
Location: New Jersey, USA
Posts: 201
|
|
roger that, loose tool, didn't realize that you said supposedly. rah. |
|
| Report Post |
|
|
|
|
|
erik206
Level 0
Join date: Jun 2008
Location: Washington, USA
Posts: 117
|
|
Loose Tool wrote:
Simon Forsyth wrote:
Now I know the Marine Corp has changed its physical fitness assesment (a marine friend of mine sent me their new training thing when he got it and he is a SSgt). Anyway with this move towards an assesment that is more appropriate to the actual needs of military personnel.
Supposedly the CFT (Combat Fitness Test) rolls out this month. It will supplement, not replace, the PFT. It will be given on a separate day. It will be pass/fail. It has three parts:
* The 880-yard sprint. Designed to simulate movement to contact, Marines will be timed running in a straight line.
* The ammo can lift. Marines will lift a 30-pound ammunition box from a starting position of chest level to above the head with both arms extended. Scores are based on the number of lifts performed in that set time period, but the scoring system is not yet approved.
* The maneuver under fire drill. A four-part obstacle course that will include sprinting, throwing a grenade, running with two ammo cans and moving a mock casualty.
vie been out of the corps for about two yrs now and i wish we had been doing this. I would get about 18 pullups and my hundred crunches but i always hated timed runs.
|
|
| Report Post |
|
|
|
|
|
erik206
Level 0
Join date: Jun 2008
Location: Washington, USA
Posts: 117
|
|
Loose Tool wrote:
Simon Forsyth wrote:
Now I know the Marine Corp has changed its physical fitness assesment (a marine friend of mine sent me their new training thing when he got it and he is a SSgt). Anyway with this move towards an assesment that is more appropriate to the actual needs of military personnel.
Supposedly the CFT (Combat Fitness Test) rolls out this month. It will supplement, not replace, the PFT. It will be given on a separate day. It will be pass/fail. It has three parts:
* The 880-yard sprint. Designed to simulate movement to contact, Marines will be timed running in a straight line.
* The ammo can lift. Marines will lift a 30-pound ammunition box from a starting position of chest level to above the head with both arms extended. Scores are based on the number of lifts performed in that set time period, but the scoring system is not yet approved.
* The maneuver under fire drill. A four-part obstacle course that will include sprinting, throwing a grenade, running with two ammo cans and moving a mock casualty.
vie been out of the corps for about two yrs now and i wish we had been doing this. I would get about 18 pullups and my hundred crunches but i always hated timed runs.
|
|
| Report Post |
|
|
|
|
|
WhiskeyTangoFox
Level 1
Join date: Jan 2008
Location: Hawaii, USA
Posts: 102
|
|
The US Army is still doing the stupid ass SU, PU, and a 2 mile run.
The best PT Test i have ever done is the GAFPB test
it involved a...
-----------------
3Km Run
100m sprint
High Jump
200m Swim
Shot Put
30Km Ruck
and 9mil qual
It definitely broke me off and im a consistent 300 guy, most of it seemed practical in combat. I try to get my joes in on it, but, well, you know joes, theyre lazy and want to get out of PT before 0645 |
|
| Report Post |
|
|
|
|
|
|
Article Discussions
