Hello everyone. I am 19 and currently torn between ROTC and enlisting. To be quite honest, ROTC is the only way I would stay in college. I have no money to finish and no idea what I want to do with my life other than going military.

I don't want a desk job, I actually want to fight. I plan on going infantry, then RIP as soon as possible. I have been training for the military for several months and my pft score 290, soon to be over 300.

What are your opinions on this? Should I go ROTC or go ahead and enlist? I have spoken to many people, including former Rangers, but I want as many opinions on this as possible. Any suggestions/info/opinions would be greatly appreciated. Thanks.

Aww, poor guy's thinking of joining the Army.

I like being enlisted, and to hell with what all these zeroes say.

That being said, enlist and use that as a springboard to OTS if that's what you want to do.

And if you're thinking Ranger, talk to an AF recruiter. You might be interested in PJ, CCT, SERE, or TACP.

I'm sort of in the same boat as you. Sort of. I went to WP for 2 years, and didn't get the major I wanted. I also spent time at Ft Hood and thought that active duty wasn't really for me, at least not for 5 yrs, so I left (that was the biggest reason). I still like the Army so I'm considering the Illinois NG.

I'm at college right now, money isn't really a problem for tuition thanks to my parents, but like HolyMac said, I can basically still gain some experience/add some more service time if I join the NG. A 20k bonus that my friend (a recruiter) told me about is also pretty sweet.

One thing I'm wondering about though is whether I should do NG now or after I get my degree, because my understanding is you are a Specialist right out of basic if you have a degree instead of an E1, which is pretty sweet. But then again, that's 2 yrs down the road anyways, so by that time I'd be close to an E4 anyways. Thoughts?

As to your question OP - it really depends on what you want to do. If you join the NG, you can have them pay for college, while gaining time in service, and then afterwards you can try out for OCS if you want once you have your degree. As enlisted, once you get higher up in rank, I think the job is much funner than a 2nd/1st LT.

You interact more with the soldiers, and I think being a team leader would be much more rewarding than a PL if that is what you are looking for (like sjoconn said, front line leader, instead of being in your office typing up an OPORD on your laptop). You also have a lot more options for cooler jobs if you kick ass.

As for ROTC, you do PT 3x a week, go to military science classes, and have 4 weeks or so of training in the summer (airborne/air assault if you are ranked high, then there's LDAC). Then after, most ROTC officers go reserve if I'm not mistaken. Anyone, feel free to correct me.

OP's profile says he is training for Marine OCS. Let me warn you that the USMC selects your job for you. In short, you make a wishlist at TBS and depending on statistical factors, you will get assigned a job. It is likely you will get one of your top 3, but no promises. If you want to be a Marine Officer, then you must accept that you are a Marine Officer FIRST, and a (insert job title here) second. Good leadership is required in every occupational field.

At the start of TBS, everyone wanted to be an infantryman and get in the fight. They had powerful attitudes, just as you do. By the end of it, it was not such a desired job. TBS will temper your judgment about many things (this is good). There is bullshit everywhere, just different flavors. I dealt with it in the infantry and comm ... as a junior Marine, NCO, and officer.

I was a prior Cpl assaultman before becoming a comm officer. Being prior enlisted has its benefits, but respect is not automatic nor is knowledge or experience. Your subordinates will not respect you if you wore stripes in the past unless you prove to them that you rate respect. The same is true for non priors.

I would suggest you NOT enlist just to say that you were. If you want to be enlisted, do it to be enlisted. Please don't use it as a stepping stone to polish your officer card. We had a SSgt with 11 years in get recycled at TBS because he was timid and inept. Don't waste the Corps' time and money to make you a professional Marine if your end state is to become an officer. Trust me, the carry over is marginal at best and will have little effect on your ability to be a good officer.

The Army guys who have contributed here have laid out some good options for you to maximize your monetary benefits. Don't wipe away other services because you think Marines are the best. Like I said, good leadership is required in every occupational field, in every service.

Ask yourself what matters more. Do you want to contribute to the war effort with your mind or with your trigger finger? The following is a gross underestimation, but you get the point.

1) Leadership opportunities, increased pay/responsibility/respect/benefits, ability to make decisions, get treated like an adult from day 1 in the fleet. Initial training is MUCH HARDER than enlisted. Can't speak for recon shit, but bootcamp was nothing compared to OCS ... and SOI was nothing compared to TBS.

2) Less control over your own life, live in the barracks, get to shoot more shit, be a guaranteed grunt, less pay/responsibility/respect/benefits up front, get treated like shit until you are a Cpl.

No worries, friend. That is what we are here for.

So describe what you are doing now. SgtMaj and SSgt in what service? I am assuming Army. Additionally, I am assuming Army enlisted, with a guaranteed job of being an infantryman of sorts. HolyMac can give you better answers than I can regarding Army matters.

Also, keep in mind that you can't pick your branch as an officer if you choose to go that route (whether it be ROTC or OCS). You make a list and all that is sorted out based on the Army's needs and how highly ranked you are.

Second, whether you join the Army National Guard or decide to go AD, there is Option 4 (guaranteed chance at Airborne school), and then there is the 18x option which could be a good route for you. This is the SF option, where you do your OSUT for 11B, then Airborne school, then SOPC (Special Operations Preparation and Conditioning), then SFAS. After that you still gotta complete SFQC and prepare for over a year's worth of training, but if you get past SFAS you should be good to go.

Might be difficult getting back into any officer pipeline and/or program (with any service) with that said "prior drop" on your record... check that one out carefully as it really depends on the type of drop it was...

You can find this on your DD-G1070 (issued in lieu of DD-214 for those with active duty training but with less than 90 days of active service)... that is if you even reported to Quantico before the arrest. You will see a code following DROP FR TRNG under remarks next to OCS MCCDC QUANT VA.

Were you dropped before, during (God, I hope not), or after your OCS training??? What type and under what circumstances was the arrest?

You don't need to answer this but these are definitely important questions to have answers to and to bring up with your recruiter when you do decide what route you are going and more importantly to know which routes actually in reality are fully open to you.

Good luck.


BTW HolyMac:
Legend? As in a highly romanticized MYTH of modern times or are you one of those cute little boxes filled with symbols on a map?

[quote]HolyMacaroni wrote:

Change your handle to WannaBeArmyAviator... GonnaBeArmyAviator... HopetoBeArmyAviator... NotYetArmyAviator...

I understand that Army Flight wash out is nearly non-existent, 5%-25%, but you could easily be:

"Needs of the US Army"

You guy's know the deal, when the Army needs people the standards are lowered, when they start filling them up they raise the standards. When I was recruiting I could put a GED with a 50 on the ASVAB in with a possession under 20g, and a DUI. Now if they have anything other than a minor misdemeanor there is no waiver authorized even if they have a college degree. The Army is very organic, things are always changing, just because something was the way it was when you experienced it, does not mean it is that way now. I don't care who tells you what, until you have orders in your hand, NOTHING is guaranteed in the Army, or the ARNG, or the USAR!

Good to see that you are thick-skinned... I know you're still wet behind the ears but I venture you'll soon learn (either by the easy or the hard way) that tags are earned and therefore must be respected.

As you have clearly and deservedly earned your "Officer" tag so has an "Aviator". Men in "our world/field of work" take this very seriously. You and I both know that you don't call youself an aviator on base while in uniform with other pilots or brass standing around. Hell, you wouldn't even say that out of uniform at a base local bar with a sound mind!!!

I might have "operated" in over 85 countries... in some pretty nasty shitholes... tramping through one arm pit of the world too many... from one conflict zone to the next... however, I never carry or ever use the "Operator" tag. Why? Respect. Period. "Operator" is reserved for the few who have paid the price and earned it by walking the walk at Ft. Bragg, Dam Neck, Hereford (now Credenhill), Bayonne, etc... that being the few who made it through selection for one of the Tier-1 JSOC/SOF units.

However, I have earned and do use Close Protection Officer, Peacekeeper, Field Security Officer, Instructor proudly... that is what I am.

Now, before you get all up in arms, know this: I am just stepping on your dick (something we do as brothers in arms so you better get used to it) and I meant it to help you... when you play with the big dogs you can't bark and act like a puppy and expect not to get mounted and bit just because your cute!

Cheers and respects.