Testosterone Nation
SEARCH

Advanced | Members

HOME    T-NATION FORUMS    TMUSCLE STORE     LOG IN
TMUSCLE Store
Flameout

Full Throttle: MMA Locker
Rating
1 2 3 4 | Next Last
 

Chad Waterbury
Contributor

Join date: Nov 2002
Location: California, USA
Posts: 5844

Welcome to the mixed martial arts (MMA) locker. The purpose of this forum is to discuss the training and methodology that goes with MMA competition.

Right now, the Ulimate Fighting Championship (UFC) is the leading organization for MMA competition, but many other organizations exist. Nevertheless, since numerous T-Nation readers have a penchant for UFC events, these events will often be discussed in this thread.

Report Post
 

Chad Waterbury
Contributor

Join date: Nov 2002
Location: California, USA
Posts: 5844

Let me start off by posting a pic of one of the most well-rounded fighters to ever put on the 4 ounce gloves: Georges "Rush" St. Pierre.

With a record of 12-1-0, GSP is the top contender for the welterweight belt (currently owned by Matt Hughes). Oh yeah, and he's sponsored by Biotest's Spike. How cool is that?

Report Post
 

Aeon Infinitus
Level 4

Join date: Mar 2005
Location: California, USA
Posts: 184

I've seen some of Georges' fights. What I saw was pretty damn impressive.

Can you give us some insight into his training schedule?

Report Post
 

Pitman
Level 0

Join date: Jan 2006
Location:
Posts: 6

I think this lockeroom is a great idea.
MMA is still in the beginning stages of deveolping training methods for maximum performance and this forum should help us to share ideas and methods.

Report Post
 

Brendan Ryan
Level 0

Join date: Oct 2005
Location: Florida, USA
Posts: 2774

I just dled UFC 58. I can't wait to see the GSP match.

There seems to exist some weird correlation between bodybuilders and MMA fighers.

Report Post
 

zdrax
Level 4

Join date: Jul 2004
Location: Washington, USA
Posts: 580

As a martial artist who is well versed not only in MMA events (I started watching UFC in '94) but also other full-contact events (Sabaki Challenge, Kyokushin, Muay Thai, K-1, ISKA), GSP may indeed be the perverbial Michael Jordan of MMA. GSP doesn't just have athleticism and strength, he has technique - something I find all too lacking in MMA. I can easily pick out the guys who have done martial arts since childhood and those who were merely brawlers and became interested in fighting later in life.

Not that those who began later in life are any less proficient (Rich Franklin etc.), I just see something in guys like GSP - whether it's an economy of motion, or a better understanding of body kinetics - that is missing in those who began training martial arts in adulthood.

GSP has an incredible diversity of technique, and really understands ring psychology. He can maneuver from the ground to standing and all points in between in a manner than I have never seen before. His background in Kyokushin Karate, other stand up arts, and BJJ make him the most complete fighter I've seen in any full contact event. In three years, he'll probably be the biggest draw in MMA.

Report Post
 

zdrax
Level 4

Join date: Jul 2004
Location: Washington, USA
Posts: 580

With regard to training, here's one:

A lot of fighters talk about "heavy legs," and I've even noticed this. Is there any way to properly gain muscle strength in the legs while managing fatigue and also preventing a decrease in speed? This seems to be the most difficult facet of my training. So many programs on T-Mag have a huge emphasis on squats, deads, and other lower body activity, I find that my leg speed and power returns to 100% for my legs only on "off" or "recovery" weeks.

Report Post
 

Dizzle
Level 0

Join date: Jul 2003
Location:
Posts: 126

Zdrax i must agree to disagree...the Michael Jordan of MMA right now is Fedor(current Pride HW Champ), sporting a record of 23-1 and his one loss was by a cut, and in the rematch beat him in brutal fashion. he right now is the king of MMA. he's beaten big nog twice,herring,coleman, goodridge, arona, cro cop, babalu,schlit,randleman.....and is a national sambo champion and has some of the most brutal standup in the game today.

gsp is deff. up there...but to be "Michael Jordan" you need to atleast have won a championship before

btw..i think gsp will beat hughes....but i like BJ in the rematch

Report Post
 

Dizzle
Level 0

Join date: Jul 2003
Location:
Posts: 126

i forgot to add gsp is deff. a physical specimen and has to be one of the biggest 170lb guys ive seen.....

CW do u know what he walking weight is?

Report Post
 

zdrax
Level 4

Join date: Jul 2004
Location: Washington, USA
Posts: 580

I meant GSP = Michael Jordan in every sense of the word. He's underappreciated by most MMA fans, and is still flying below the radar. He won't be 90s/Bulls MJ for another 2 or 3 years.

Report Post
 

V R
Level 2

Join date: Jan 2005
Location:
Posts: 1822

zdrax wrote:
With regard to training, here's one:

A lot of fighters talk about "heavy legs," and I've even noticed this. Is there any way to properly gain muscle strength in the legs while managing fatigue and also preventing a decrease in speed? This seems to be the most difficult facet of my training. So many programs on T-Mag have a huge emphasis on squats, deads, and other lower body activity, I find that my leg speed and power returns to 100% for my legs only on "off" or "recovery" weeks.


Plyometrics and sprints. they are an absolute MUST. You can NOT get by on doing weight training alone for legs. Strength training only builds a bigger engine. In order to fine tune that engine, one must do plyo's and explosive movements....

Report Post
 

ytbones
Level 4

Join date: Feb 2005
Location:
Posts: 133

Chad Waterbury wrote:
Welcome to the mixed martial arts (MMA) locker. The purpose of this forum is to discuss the training and methodology that goes with MMA competition.

Right now, the Ulimate Fighting Championship (UFC) is the leading organization for MMA competition, but many other organizations exist. Nevertheless, since numerous T-Nation readers have a penchant for UFC events, these events will often be discussed in this thread.



I would have to disagree. UFC is not the leading organization. PRIDE events have a much larger audience, higher payed fighters, and more talent overall.

The UFC is the leading organization in the USA but has a long way to go before it is even close to the level of PRIDE.

Report Post
 

ChenZen
Level 1

Join date: Jun 2004
Location: Quebec, CAN
Posts: 137

I've seen GSP here in downtown montreal with David loiseau too many times to count.One of my friends sparred with him at the old UCC academy in Verdun (montreal)3-4 years ago.Although i've never had the chance to speak with him personally, based on what i've seen he walks around at about 190.And in case nobody else heard David loiseau trains at the new Poliquin performance center that just opened up here in Montreal.

Report Post
 

lifter82
Level 0

Join date: Jun 2004
Location: Virginia, USA
Posts: 92

Chad Waterbury wrote:
Let me start off by posting a pic of one of the most well-rounded fighters to ever put on the 4 ounce gloves: Georges "Rush" St. Pierre.

With a record of 12-1-0, GSP is the top contender for the welterweight belt (currently owned by Matt Hughes). Oh yeah, and he's sponsored by Biotest's Spike. How cool is that?


didn't matt hughes already beat him once before in a championship match?

also...i watching an UFC special on SpikeTV, forgot the title, where they had a fighter go through his daily routine.
he had a protein shake in the morning. i think they just should that as a clip. however, this guy keeps track of EVERYTHING he puts into himself. he's all natural. a food log and proper measurement for everything he consumes.

his workouts seemed to consists of a full body circuit training for every muscle of the body. this lasted for an hour, non-stop. he did mostly, if not all machine, workouts. strange. there were several iso movements in the circuit. nonetheless...i doubt most of the guys here could keep up w/ that.

Report Post
 

zdrax
Level 4

Join date: Jul 2004
Location: Washington, USA
Posts: 580

ChenZen wrote:
I've seen GSP here in downtown montreal with David loiseau too many times to count.One of my friends sparred with him at the old UCC academy in Verdun (montreal)3-4 years ago.Although i've never had the chance to speak with him personally, based on what i've seen he walks around at about 190.And in case nobody else heard David loiseau trains at the new Poliquin performance center that just opened up here in Montreal.


I wonder what sort of diet he put Loiseau on. I know Charles goes low carb with most of his athletes.

Report Post
 

Sifu
Level 4

Join date: Oct 2002
Location:
Posts: 2909

One thing that I find helps my kicking speed is to give a full week in between leg workouts, to fully recover.

If I'm feeling tired and sluggish I don't work on speed kicking. For this reason I don't practice kicking the day after my leg workout.

Report Post
 

V R
Level 2

Join date: Jan 2005
Location:
Posts: 1822

lifter82 wrote:
Chad Waterbury wrote:
Let me start off by posting a pic of one of the most well-rounded fighters to ever put on the 4 ounce gloves: Georges "Rush" St. Pierre.

With a record of 12-1-0, GSP is the top contender for the welterweight belt (currently owned by Matt Hughes). Oh yeah, and he's sponsored by Biotest's Spike. How cool is that?

didn't matt hughes already beat him once before in a championship match?

also...i watching an UFC special on SpikeTV, forgot the title, where they had a fighter go through his daily routine.
he had a protein shake in the morning. i think they just should that as a clip. however, this guy keeps track of EVERYTHING he puts into himself. he's all natural. a food log and proper measurement for everything he consumes.

his workouts seemed to consists of a full body circuit training for every muscle of the body. this lasted for an hour, non-stop. he did mostly, if not all machine, workouts. strange. there were several iso movements in the circuit. nonetheless...i doubt most of the guys here could keep up w/ that.


Alot of MMA guys are just like alot of pro athletes - they really dont know how to train well. Ive seen and read quite a few MMA guys whose training regimines were laughable. They talked about jogging, machine weight lifting, swimming, etc...stuff I wouldn't do if it were the last thing on earth.

Report Post
 

mf
Level 4

Join date: Oct 2002
Location: Arizona, USA
Posts: 4

The fighter in the Spike all access special was Rich Franklin.

Another great way to build explosive power is to train olympic lifts.

Report Post
 

Djwlfpack
Level 2

Join date: Feb 2003
Location:
Posts: 2614

Chad,
Great idea for the Locker Room! MMA is certainly a sport on the rise. I'm actually doing a story for the newspaper I work for here in Colorado profiling a local fighter who also is an MMA instructor. It should be done (hopefully) tomorrow and published next week. I'll post a link to it once it's up on the web.

Pat Miletich is coming out next month to do a 3-day seminar and that's going to be a great time.

My question is in regards to overtraining. How many days a week would you have someone train (both boxing/MMA classes and weight training)?

I'm currently working out five days a week; 2 days of MMA/boxing class/home workout (depending on schedule) and 3 days of weight training (TBT).

-------------------------------------
Oh, and as you can tell by my avatar I'm a huge fan of Chuck Liddell, although I was torn when he fought Randy Couture just because I have so much respect for that man.
-Dan

Report Post
 

Professor Chaos
Level 5

Join date: Jan 2003
Location: Texas, USA
Posts: 272

Djwlfpack wrote:
Chad,
Great idea for the Locker Room! MMA is certainly a sport on the rise. I'm actually doing a story for the newspaper I work for here in Colorado profiling a local fighter who also is an MMA instructor. It should be done (hopefully) tomorrow and published next week. I'll post a link to it once it's up on the web.

Pat Miletich is coming out next month to do a 3-day seminar and that's going to be a great time.

My question is in regards to overtraining. How many days a week would you have someone train (both boxing/MMA classes and weight training)?

I'm currently working out five days a week; 2 days of MMA/boxing class/home workout (depending on schedule) and 3 days of weight training (TBT).

-------------------------------------
Oh, and as you can tell by my avatar I'm a huge fan of Chuck Liddell, although I was torn when he fought Randy Couture just because I have so much respect for that man.
-Dan


I second this question for you Chad... If you train for mma grappling and boxing every day, how often do you think you could train with weights?

Report Post
 

samdiesel
Level 4

Join date: Feb 2004
Location: New York, USA
Posts: 279

Fedor is the unquestioned ruler of the universe. His physique has something to be desired, but he is unbeatable. Technique trumps all.

Report Post
 

Chad Waterbury
Contributor

Join date: Nov 2002
Location: California, USA
Posts: 5844

Aeon Infinitus wrote:
I've seen some of Georges' fights. What I saw was pretty damn impressive.

Can you give us some insight into his training schedule?


Okay, I'm glad you brought this up. I don't currently train any UFC fighters, so I can't comment on their specific routines. Furthermore, no fighter (that I know of) works with only one guy. Most fighters spread their time between various experts in a given style. For instance, GSP wrestles with the Canadian team in Quebec, and he's worked with Renzo Gracie in New York.

Also, for me to write out the entire regimen of a UFC fighter would take about 10K words.

The purpose of this thread is to discuss various philosophies and training techniques to help those interested in MMA. And of course, it's a great place to throw around new ideas while discussing the direction that this soon-to-be mainstream sport is taking.

Report Post
 

Chad Waterbury
Contributor

Join date: Nov 2002
Location: California, USA
Posts: 5844

Pitman wrote:
I think this lockeroom is a great idea.
MMA is still in the beginning stages of deveolping training methods for maximum performance and this forum should help us to share ideas and methods.


You've got that right.

Report Post
 

Chad Waterbury
Contributor

Join date: Nov 2002
Location: California, USA
Posts: 5844

zdrax wrote:
As a martial artist who is well versed not only in MMA events (I started watching UFC in '94) but also other full-contact events (Sabaki Challenge, Kyokushin, Muay Thai, K-1, ISKA), GSP may indeed be the perverbial Michael Jordan of MMA. GSP doesn't just have athleticism and strength, he has technique - something I find all too lacking in MMA. I can easily pick out the guys who have done martial arts since childhood and those who were merely brawlers and became interested in fighting later in life.

Not that those who began later in life are any less proficient (Rich Franklin etc.), I just see something in guys like GSP - whether it's an economy of motion, or a better understanding of body kinetics - that is missing in those who began training martial arts in adulthood.

GSP has an incredible diversity of technique, and really understands ring psychology. He can maneuver from the ground to standing and all points in between in a manner than I have never seen before. His background in Kyokushin Karate, other stand up arts, and BJJ make him the most complete fighter I've seen in any full contact event. In three years, he'll probably be the biggest draw in MMA.


Great points. The reason why I'm so passionate about MMA (ie, UFC events) is that the athletes must be proficient in numerous techniques. As you alluded to, the days of a "single discipline" fighter are damn-near extinct.

Take, for example, the incredible Chuck Liddell. From a novice's standpoint, he just seems to want to stand and exchange blows. But in reality, his wrestling ability - importantly, his takedown defense - is second to none.

Even though he's one of the best strikers, he never would've won the belt with that alone. He's a great kicker, his takedown defense is excellent, and of course, he hits like an oncoming freight train.

Report Post
 

Sentoguy
Level 2

Join date: Nov 2005
Location:
Posts: 4033

Hi guys,

Yeah, when it comes to MMA Fedor is the man. There isn't anybody in MMA that could beat that guy (99 out of 100 fights). The only 2 guys out there that I think might have a chance to dethrown him are Cro Cop (simply because he hits so damn hard) and Arlovski (I know, I know, the heavyweights in the UFC pale in comparison to the Pride heavyweights, but still the guy has serious talent).

Speaking of Arlovski, I'd rank him right up there with GSP as the future of the sport. Now granted Arlovski is already the reigning UFC heavyweight champion, and honestly I don't see anyone in the heavyweight division beating him, sadly I think that it will only be a matter of time before he goes to Pride (as stated before; better pay, higher level of competition, etc...).

As for GSP being the most well rounded guy to ever step into the Octagon, well......I think that's debatable. What about Frank Shamrock? Although you never hear anyone in the UFC mention his name (due to financial disputes), he whooped on absolutely everyone he ever fought in the UFC's light heavyweight division, and in my opinion would still beat anyone in that division (possibly with the exception of Babalu judging by what he did in a recent Pride event), and maybe Liddell (if he connected with a good shot).

Shamrock is every bit as versatile as GSP, evey bit as much of a natural athlete (he only trained for 4 years prior to entering MMA, after which he became a 7 time King Of Pancrase, and 5 time UFC light heavyweight champion), and every bit as technically skilled. Everyone has seemed to completely erase him from their memories for some reason.

As for actual training, I'd say that the question of volume and frequency is very dependent on how long you've been training and what kind of training you've been exposed to.

Good training,

Sentoguy

Report Post
1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 | Next Last
Administrators Online: Nate Green, LowfatMatt, Mod Phoenix, Chris Shugart, Mod Brian