| The Merit of Quarter Squats |
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limitatinfinity
Level 0
Join date: Apr 2009
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Posts: 194
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So, there are obvious reasons not to do "ego squatting"
where you sacrifice depth as the load increases...
...decreased training effect because of limited ROM, large amounts of shear force unloaded at the knee, etc...
What about concentric only lockouts with supramaximal weight?
Since there's no amortization loading on the knee could this be used as a good intermediate between heavy walkouts and regular squatting to depth?
So you'd do regular heavy squatting followed by a few singles of lockouts finishing with a heavy walkout.
Anyone used these in the past with heavy squatting and/or walkouts to get used to heavier loads?
Thanks
lim@infinity |
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pushharder
Level 4
Join date: Apr 2005
Location: Montana, USA
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Yes, I use them. But I am careful to call them supramaximal holds and not squats and I don't quote the poundages I use for them and tell the internet world that that's what I squat. |
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skidmark
Level 1
Join date: Aug 2006
Location: California, USA
Posts: 3894
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I've also used them and also do not call them squats. They are partial or high Anderson squats in my logs and I use them to break a plateau or strengthen my spinal erectors |
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pushmepullme
Level 3
Join date: May 2008
Location: Ireland
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I do power curtsies every once in a while when I'm bored. They are not squats. |
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pushmepullme
Level 3
Join date: May 2008
Location: Ireland
Posts: 6436
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Stronghold wrote:
"If you're squatting deep, you're not trying hard enough"
You missing a "not"? |
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Stronghold
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Join date: Dec 2006
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pushmepullme wrote:
Stronghold wrote:
"If you're squatting deep, you're not trying hard enough"
You missing a "not"?
Nope, because I'm a high squatting, steroid taking, not walking out, 800 plies of canvas and rocket boosters on my ass multiply cheater. |
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burt128
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Join date: Apr 2003
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Stronghold wrote:
pushmepullme wrote:
Stronghold wrote:
"If you're squatting deep, you're not trying hard enough"
You missing a "not"?
Nope, because I'm a high squatting, steroid taking, not walking out, 800 plies of canvas and rocket boosters on my ass multiply cheater.
You're kidding, right?
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kylec72
Level 3
Join date: Nov 2008
Location: Arizona, USA
Posts: 401
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pushharder wrote:
Yes, I use them. But I am careful to call them supramaximal holds and not squats and I don't quote the poundages I use for them and tell the internet world that that's what I squat.
Could you elaborate further on how/when and for what purpose you personally use the 'supramaximal holds'? Thanks. |
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limitatinfinity
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Join date: Apr 2009
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pushharder wrote:
Yes, I use them. But I am careful to call them supramaximal holds and not squats and I don't quote the poundages I use for them and tell the internet world that that's what I squat.
Well, I call them quarter squats and quote my atg squat on the internet.
The depth I've been doing them recently has been maybe 3-4 inches above parallel/legal depth with a wider stance then I normally squat when I do full squats.
So my range of motion here is not so limited that I would call them "supramaximal holds".
I can handle significantly more weight than my atg squat.
I've done 500lbs for two singles and followed by 585 for a 10 sec walkout and hold.
I've been doing atg squatting for a while, so I started doing these in hopes of sparing my knees and still getting a new training effect for the posterior chain with wider, hip-dominant squatting. I'm also hoping that it will carry over to improve my DL.
Any thoughts?
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pushharder
Level 4
Join date: Apr 2005
Location: Montana, USA
Posts: 18654
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kylec72 wrote:
pushharder wrote:
Yes, I use them. But I am careful to call them supramaximal holds and not squats and I don't quote the poundages I use for them and tell the internet world that that's what I squat.
Could you elaborate further on how/when and for what purpose you personally use the 'supramaximal holds'? Thanks.
It primes the nervous system.
I mainly use them on heavy squat day when I'm lifting singles or doubles.
1. Load ~ 50 - 90 lbs. heavier than working weight
2. Walkout
3. Hold at bottom of 1/4 squat for 7 - 10 seconds
4. Re-rack and drop to working weight
5. Wait 30 - 90 seconds
6. Squat working weight
When I walkout and 1/4 squat with the extra weight I tell my body, "OK, you sonuvabitch, this is what you have to squat today."
Body replies, "Holy shit, man, I can't go ATG with that kind of weight! What-da-hell is the matter with you?"
So I re-rack and strip off the 50 - 90 lbs. and walkout again and ask, "Now whadda ya think, you fuckin pansy?"
The body says, "Now THIS is no problem. Let's do it, dooood."
Down and up we go. Bada bing. Deception at its finest. |
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pushharder
Level 4
Join date: Apr 2005
Location: Montana, USA
Posts: 18654
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limitatinfinity wrote:
pushharder wrote:
Yes, I use them. But I am careful to call them supramaximal holds and not squats and I don't quote the poundages I use for them and tell the internet world that that's what I squat.
Well, I call them quarter squats and quote my atg squat on the internet.
The depth I've been doing them recently has been maybe 3-4 inches above parallel/legal depth with a wider stance then I normally squat when I do full squats.
So my range of motion here is not so limited that I would call them "supramaximal holds".
I can handle significantly more weight than my atg squat.
We all can.
I've done 500lbs for two singles and followed by 585 for a 10 sec walkout and hold.
If you're using them to accustom your body to heavier weights and you have a designed, specific training effect purpose, then yeah, OK.
I've been doing atg squatting for a while, so I started doing these in hopes of sparing my knees
You "spare your knees" by going deep and getting your hips and entire posterior chain involved in the movement. You put extraordinary amounts of stress on the knee joint by forcing it to "brake" the concentric movement with 1/4 and 1/2 squats.
I distinctly remember the knee pain I used to have when I squatted like 90+% of the average gym goers.
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zildjianman
Level 3
Join date: May 2008
Location: Colorado, USA
Posts: 486
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pushmepullme wrote:
I do power curtsies every once in a while when I'm bored. They are not squats.
Would I be changing the subject to ask for a video of proof ? No, I take it back, I'll see you at the curtsie meet.
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limitatinfinity
Level 0
Join date: Apr 2009
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pushharder wrote:
limitatinfinity wrote:
pushharder wrote:
Yes, I use them. But I am careful to call them supramaximal holds and not squats and I don't quote the poundages I use for them and tell the internet world that that's what I squat.
Well, I call them quarter squats and quote my atg squat on the internet.
The depth I've been doing them recently has been maybe 3-4 inches above parallel/legal depth with a wider stance then I normally squat when I do full squats.
So my range of motion here is not so limited that I would call them "supramaximal holds".
I can handle significantly more weight than my atg squat.
We all can.
I've done 500lbs for two singles and followed by 585 for a 10 sec walkout and hold.
If you're using them to accustom your body to heavier weights and you have a designed, specific training effect purpose, then yeah, OK.
I am and I do.
I've been doing atg squatting for a while, so I started doing these in hopes of sparing my knees
You "spare your knees" by going deep and getting your hips and entire posterior chain involved in the movement. You put extraordinary amounts of stress on the knee joint by forcing it to "brake" the concentric movement with 1/4 and 1/2 squats.
I distinctly remember the knee pain I used to have when I squatted like 90+% of the average gym goers.
I understand this.
I'm doing concentric only singles.
Did you mean "break" instead of "brake", because there's no eccentric(lowering) here that I'm trying to stop/brake(amortization) before the concentric(lifting)?
Do you mean that a large amounts of stress is loaded on the knees even with concentric only 1/4 squats because you have to "break" the concentric from a dead start?
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pushharder
Level 4
Join date: Apr 2005
Location: Montana, USA
Posts: 18654
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limitatinfinity wrote:
I've been doing atg squatting for a while, so I started doing these in hopes of sparing my knees
You "spare your knees" by going deep and getting your hips and entire posterior chain involved in the movement. You put extraordinary amounts of stress on the knee joint by forcing it to "brake" the concentric movement with 1/4 and 1/2 squats.
I distinctly remember the knee pain I used to have when I squatted like 90+% of the average gym goers.
I understand this.
I'm doing concentric only singles.
Did you mean "break" instead of "brake", because there's no eccentric(lowering) here that I'm trying to stop/brake(amortization) before the concentric(lifting)?
Do you mean that a large amounts of stress is loaded on the knees even with concentric only 1/4 squats because you have to "brake" the concentric from a dead start?
No, I meant "brake". Obviously, if you are doing concentrics only that is different.
You are starting concentric movement with bar on pins, I take it?
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limitatinfinity
Level 0
Join date: Apr 2009
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pushharder wrote:
limitatinfinity wrote:
I've been doing atg squatting for a while, so I started doing these in hopes of sparing my knees
You "spare your knees" by going deep and getting your hips and entire posterior chain involved in the movement. You put extraordinary amounts of stress on the knee joint by forcing it to "brake" the concentric movement with 1/4 and 1/2 squats.
I distinctly remember the knee pain I used to have when I squatted like 90+% of the average gym goers.
I understand this.
I'm doing concentric only singles.
Did you mean "break" instead of "brake", because there's no eccentric(lowering) here that I'm trying to stop/brake(amortization) before the concentric(lifting)?
Do you mean that a large amounts of stress is loaded on the knees even with concentric only 1/4 squats because you have to "brake" the concentric from a dead start?
No, I meant "brake". Obviously, if you are doing concentrics only that is different.
You are starting concentric movement with bar on pins, I take it?
Yep. Dead start single from the pins. Partner helps me rack then we move the bar back to the pins for the next single. |
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ouroboro_s
Level 2
Join date: Feb 2008
Location: Ontario, CAN
Posts: 4509
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Stronghold wrote:
pushmepullme wrote:
Stronghold wrote:
"If you're squatting deep, you're not trying hard enough"
You missing a "not"?
Nope, because I'm a high squatting, steroid taking, not walking out, 800 plies of canvas and rocket boosters on my ass multiply cheater.
That's cool. Do the boosters go up before or after the briefs go on? I've always wondered.
I do power curtsies from time to time to mentally adjust to heavier loads on my back. |
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detazathoth
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Join date: Jan 2007
Location: Massachusetts, USA
Posts: 2914
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ouroboro_s wrote:
Stronghold wrote:
pushmepullme wrote:
Stronghold wrote:
"If you're squatting deep, you're not trying hard enough"
You missing a "not"?
Nope, because I'm a high squatting, steroid taking, not walking out, 800 plies of canvas and rocket boosters on my ass multiply cheater.
That's cool. Do the boosters go up before or after the briefs go on? I've always wondered.
I do power curtsies from time to time to mentally adjust to heavier loads on my back.
They go on after the briefs, it took me 20min to set those up too. Anyway, I likewise do power curtsies after doing Max Effort work if the my Coach puts on the today's training. |
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kylec72
Level 3
Join date: Nov 2008
Location: Arizona, USA
Posts: 401
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pushharder wrote:
kylec72 wrote:
pushharder wrote:
Yes, I use them. But I am careful to call them supramaximal holds and not squats and I don't quote the poundages I use for them and tell the internet world that that's what I squat.
Could you elaborate further on how/when and for what purpose you personally use the 'supramaximal holds'? Thanks.
It primes the nervous system.
I mainly use them on heavy squat day when I'm lifting singles or doubles.
1. Load ~ 50 - 90 lbs. heavier than working weight
2. Walkout
3. Hold at bottom of 1/4 squat for 7 - 10 seconds
4. Re-rack and drop to working weight
5. Wait 30 - 90 seconds
6. Squat working weight
When I walkout and 1/4 squat with the extra weight I tell my body, "OK, you sonuvabitch, this is what you have to squat today."
Body replies, "Holy shit, man, I can't go ATG with that kind of weight! What-da-hell is the matter with you?"
So I re-rack and strip off the 50 - 90 lbs. and walkout again and ask, "Now whadda ya think, you fuckin pansy?"
The body says, "Now THIS is no problem. Let's do it, dooood."
Down and up we go. Bada bing. Deception at its finest.
That's a really interesting idea. Those singles and doubles prob feel much easier after walking out the heavy weight. |
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giterdone
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Join date: Jul 2008
Location: Nova scotia, CAN
Posts: 922
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Push, I like the supramaximal idea. I haven't done that but I will. Kind of like swinging a bat with weight in the batter's box.
I have done an Anderson setup as Skid mentioned and it works. Start with a weight higher than max on pins and progressively drop the pin height week by week. I do have to watch my knees though. As Push mentioned, I feel more knee strain with a high "squat" than a full squat. |
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ouroboro_s
Level 2
Join date: Feb 2008
Location: Ontario, CAN
Posts: 4509
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giterdone wrote:
Push, I like the supramaximal idea. I haven't done that but I will. Kind of like swinging a bat with weight in the batter's box.
I have done an Anderson setup as Skid mentioned and it works. Start with a weight higher than max on pins and progressively drop the pin height week by week. I do have to watch my knees though. As Push mentioned, I feel more knee strain with a high "squat" than a full squat.
Breaking it off pins at the bottom of a squat will also feel heavier than starting at the top and squatting the weight to that depth. Breaking the inertia is a killer. It's kind of the same way that dead lifts fry your body; the bar is totally dead with no stored kinetic energy. I've done them a lot in the past and find they've strengthened my legs quite a bit. |
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brauny96
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Join date: Jan 2009
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i used to do a box squat which is a quarter squat, but i got rid of it cuz it never helped |
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giterdone
Level 0
Join date: Jul 2008
Location: Nova scotia, CAN
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ouroboro_s wrote:
giterdone wrote:
Push, I like the supramaximal idea. I haven't done that but I will. Kind of like swinging a bat with weight in the batter's box.
I have done an Anderson setup as Skid mentioned and it works. Start with a weight higher than max on pins and progressively drop the pin height week by week. I do have to watch my knees though. As Push mentioned, I feel more knee strain with a high "squat" than a full squat.
Breaking it off pins at the bottom of a squat will also feel heavier than starting at the top and squatting the weight to that depth. Breaking the inertia is a killer. It's kind of the same way that dead lifts fry your body; the bar is totally dead with no stored kinetic energy. I've done them a lot in the past and find they've strengthened my legs quite a bit.
Agreed. You setup, take a big breath and start pushing. Just like a deadlift, you start thinking "common you bitch start moving!" Once it breaks it goes up fine. |
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SteelyD
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Location: Maine, USA
Posts: 5588
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pushmepullme wrote:
I do power curtsies every once in a while when I'm bored. They are not squats.
"Power curtsies"... I like that ;)
Another take on these that I do once in awhile is to load the weight up (I usually add a plate more than I can squat), shoulder the weight (a la 'walkouts'), but lower it 2 pins than where I shouldered the weight (maybe 5" down on the squat rack).
Take a rest, reset, then lift back to the original pin. Progress to the next lower pin(s) over time. |
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