Join date: Mar 2006
Location: New York, USA
Posts: 3471
FightinIrish26 wrote:
You are all foolish if you believe that he will launch a nuclear weapon under the flag of Iran.
This is the same fucking thing I said about Saddam, and about Kim Jong Il- they like being in power. In fact, they love it. They're not going to give that up for ANYTHING in this world, and they're not going to risk total annihilation by trying to nuke anyone, regardless of what they say.
For such America-centric assholes, you people sure forget quickly who is the unequivocal top dog in the world. We are a pittbull looking down at a yipping runt of a dog in Iran- he can say all he wants, but in the end it takes one big bite to end him. And don't think he doesn't know that.
You people amaze me.
What do you mean "you people?"
...Actually, yeah I pretty much agree with Irish on this one. MAD works. It works REALLY REALLY well.
Fareed Zakaria wrote a really great piece about Iran having nukes not being a bad thing in a Newsweek from like four months ago. I was pretty convinced by it, along with the weight of history of course.
Join date: Feb 2003
Location: Pennsylvania, USA
Posts: 4800
MAD works if the parties involved are rational. The Iranians aren't rational and have a religious agenda that pretty much excuses them of responsibility and provides a reward as long as they kill infidels.
MAD worked against the Soviets and most Western nations because they are secular and rational. Let's face it the Soviets knew they didn't have the offensive capability to completely take out the US nuclear forces. Poor accuracy and reliability of their ICBM's wasn't up to the task, the SLBM's they have still aren't reliable and the subs would have been taken out before they could fire. Sure a few long range bombers and some of the missles would have made it to the US. Substantially all of our nukes would have hit their targets in the USSR and exploded, thereby ending the story. MAD worked because the outcome was assured, the Soviets knew it was a losing proposition. Now if they believed they would be rewarded in the after life for killing in the present life....the story may have turned out different.
Zakaria believes the Iranians to be rational players. To assume they are is dangerous because it involves trusting your enemy will do something. Never depend on that.
hedo wrote:
MAD works if the parties involved are rational. The Iranians aren't rational and have a religious agenda that pretty much excuses them of responsibility and provides a reward as long as they kill infidels.
Zakaria believes the Iranians to be rational players. To assume they are is dangerous because it involves trusting your enemy will do something. Never depend on that.
"If you haven't discovered the vast conspiracy by the West against USSR, it means you haven't dug deep enough" - Joe Stalin
Russians were masters of paranoia - not just Stalin who shot government officials by the dozen for failing to provide him with the proof about the diabolical Western conspiracy - but also Kruschev, Brezhnev and Andropov.
For example, during the NATO Able Archer exercise in early 1980ies, several Politburo members advocated a Sovier first strike.
As far as the Iranians are concerned, let's not confuse them with the likes of mullah Omar who, according to some sources, was convinced "infidels" had a third eye.
They are a nasty, ruthless, cynical bunch, that's certain. But not irrational. Of course, they play by different rules than the West, but so was Mao during the Korean War.
Join date: Mar 2006
Location: New York, USA
Posts: 3471
hedo wrote:
Zakaria believes the Iranians to be rational players. To assume they are is dangerous because it involves trusting your enemy will do something. Never depend on that.
The Iranian's are rational. Trust me. They may support insane people, but insane people (relative insanity <_<) don't run the government. They know as well as everyone else what would happen to Iran should they set off a nuclear device in an act of war.
Insane and religiously driven =/= Retarded.
My worry is that they might let their device or uranium fall into the hands of someone truly insane, with not national ties. As far as I see, the nations of the world will NOT go nuclear, simply because they know the result is apocalyptic.
"If you haven't discovered the vast conspiracy by the West against USSR, it means you haven't dug deep enough" - Joe Stalin
"If you haven't discovered that Joseph Stalin was a Catholic Priest in his younger years and a Catholic Priest covertly acting for the Catholic Church in his older years, it means you're an idiot."
Abe Lincoln and The Mazzini Royal Family and Albert Pike wrote that The Catholic Church was planning "3 World Wars":
1.) make Russia Atheist
2.) give Israel to Jews
3.) Jews and Muslim anihilate each other and all nations except Russia and their other atheist neighbors get involved trying to stop the Jews and Muslims in the middle east from destroying each other...everyone gets weak but Russia and China...then Russia and China take over the world making the world atheist and removing all religions...
then they make the world Catholic...Abe Lincon wrote a little too much and got killed...
he did write however that "the Jesuit Order has tried to kill me numerous times and eventually will succeed" in alomst exact words in his autobiography...
- Lenin was a Catholic plant by the way
- sources say that Lenin was trained in NYC by them and then they sent him a train load of gold when he started his revolution
- but you guys already know this
Join date: Oct 2002
Location: Ohio, USA
Posts: 12974
newbatman wrote:
loppar wrote:
"If you haven't discovered the vast conspiracy by the West against USSR, it means you haven't dug deep enough" - Joe Stalin
"If you haven't discovered that Joseph Stalin was a Catholic Priest in his younger years and a Catholic Priest covertly acting for the Catholic Church in his older years, it means you're an idiot."
Wouldn't stalin have been Orthodox? Russians aren't Catholics.
Join date: Aug 2008
Location: Florida, USA
Posts: 343
newbatman wrote:
loppar wrote:
"If you haven't discovered the vast conspiracy by the West against USSR, it means you haven't dug deep enough" - Joe Stalin
"If you haven't discovered that Joseph Stalin was a Catholic Priest in his younger years and a Catholic Priest covertly acting for the Catholic Church in his older years, it means you're an idiot."
I don't beleive he was a priest but he did go to school to eneter the priesthood. Have you read the book Young Stalin? I need to reread it.
"If you haven't discovered the vast conspiracy by the West against USSR, it means you haven't dug deep enough" - Joe Stalin
"If you haven't discovered that Joseph Stalin was a Catholic Priest in his younger years and a Catholic Priest covertly acting for the Catholic Church in his older years, it means you're an idiot."
Wouldn't stalin have been Orthodox? Russians aren't Catholics.
I am just stating what the History Channel special said...
the whole week of the tsunamis in 2004 I was in the hospital with blood clots watching the History Channel Stalin special...
Join date: Oct 2002
Location: Oklahoma, USA
Posts: 1462
newbatman wrote:
Headhunter wrote:
newbatman wrote:
loppar wrote:
"If you haven't discovered the vast conspiracy by the West against USSR, it means you haven't dug deep enough" - Joe Stalin
"If you haven't discovered that Joseph Stalin was a Catholic Priest in his younger years and a Catholic Priest covertly acting for the Catholic Church in his older years, it means you're an idiot."
Wouldn't stalin have been Orthodox? Russians aren't Catholics.
I am just stating what the History Channel special said...
the whole week of the tsunamis in 2004 I was in the hospital with blood clots watching the History Channel Stalin special...
it was a week of Stalin...
I am such a history nerd...
The Hitler Channel is known for historical and journalistic accuracy.
Join date: Oct 2002
Location: Georgia, USA
Posts: 6758
newbatman wrote:
Headhunter wrote:
newbatman wrote:
loppar wrote:
"If you haven't discovered the vast conspiracy by the West against USSR, it means you haven't dug deep enough" - Joe Stalin
"If you haven't discovered that Joseph Stalin was a Catholic Priest in his younger years and a Catholic Priest covertly acting for the Catholic Church in his older years, it means you're an idiot."
Wouldn't stalin have been Orthodox? Russians aren't Catholics.
I am just stating what the History Channel special said...
the whole week of the tsunamis in 2004 I was in the hospital with blood clots watching the History Channel Stalin special...
it was a week of Stalin...
I am such a history nerd...
I saw a history channel program on stalin and it said nothing of the sort. He got kicked out of seminary because of his radical views and he was decidedly and distinctly an atheist. That was a requirement to be a member of the governement.
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